Madam Speaker: Prior to Oral Questions, I would like to draw the attention of all honourable members to the public gallery where we have this afternoon nineteen Grade 9 students from Victor Mager School under the direction of Mr. Larry Pattrick. This school is located in the constituency of the honourable Minister of Northern Affairs, Minister responsible for Native Affairs and Minister of Energy and Mines (Mr. Newman).

Also, twenty-eight Grade 11 students from Nellie McClung Collegiate under the direction of Mr. Grant Caldwell. This school is located in the constituency of the honourable member for Pembina (Mr. Dyck).

We also have sixteen Grades 12 and 13 students from the Dryden High School in Dryden, Ontario, under the direction of Mr. Jim Black.

On behalf of all honourable members, I welcome you this afternoon.

Mr. Gary Doer (Leader of the Opposition): Madam Speaker, on April 15, 1998, the Minister of Health told this Chamber, dealing with the frozen food, that this plan was developed by the nine hospitals. In April of 1999 the Minister of Health stated that they support the objectives of the economy of scale of this food preparation project. I would like to ask the minister whether any conditions came from the government down to the urban hospitals to force Winnipeg hospitals to join Filmon's frozen food in urban hospitals in Winnipeg.

Hon. Eric Stefanson (Minister of Health): The member is correct in identifying that the Urban Shared Services Corporation is a corporation of the nine urban hospitals here in the city of Winnipeg. The CEOs, the chief executive officers, of those nine hospitals serve on the board of that corporation. I believe there are a few citizen members appointed at large as well, Mr. John Bullman, for one. So that is how the entity was created.

The objectives are certainly to provide quality food, to provide nutritional food and to do it as efficiently and effectively as possible to avoid additional capital costs and obviously to improve efficiencies in terms of the delivery of the food, and any savings that can be achieved through that process can be left in the health care system to provide other much-needed services to Manitobans. So that certainly has been the objective throughout the entire process, and that certainly is an objective worthy of support.

Mr. Doer: The minister did not answer my question. I asked whether there were any top-down conditions to force the urban hospitals to join this Filmon frozen food initiative. I would like to quote from a memo from the Department of Health in February of 1998 where a clear condition for dealing with the hospital deficits, deficits of course that were established with reductions in operating grants from the province–clearly condition 7 was that you must utilize the services for all of the frozen food services.

I would like to ask this minister: why has he purported to say that this was an initiative of the Urban Shared Services and hospitals when it was a top-down condition of this government?

* (1350)

Mr. Stefanson: Madam Speaker, the issue of the centralization of food delivery services has been an issue that has been around for several years, and the Leader of the Opposition is certainly well aware of that. This issue has been talked about for several years in terms of the implementation, the thinking behind the implementation, the rationale in terms of what I have already outlined in terms of avoiding capital costs, improving efficiencies, saving those dollars, redirecting them into health care, and continuing to focus on quality nutritional food. So it is not an issue that just originated a year ago. It has been an issue that has been under review and consideration with the support of those nine urban hospitals for quite some time.

Mr. Doer: Madam Speaker, the government cuts $40 million out of the operating grants to hospitals, lays off over a thousand nurses, has hospitals run up deficits and then makes one of the conditions of dealing with the deficits the Filmon frozen food. The Minister of Justice (Mr. Toews) sends out a letter to his constituents–

Madam Speaker: Order, please.

Mr. Marcel Laurendeau (St. Norbert): Madam Speaker, I have listened very carefully to the honourable Leader of the official opposition. This is the second time. All honourable members in this Chamber should be recognized as honourable members or by their ministerial portfolio. This member has not been recognizing that fact.

Madam Speaker: Order, please. On the point of order raised by the honourable member for St. Norbert, indeed the honourable member does have a point of order. All members in the Legislature are to be referred to not by their surnames but by their constituencies.

Mr. Doer: Well, I can understand the sensitivity of wanting to have the member for Tuxedo's (Mr. Filmon) name not mentioned in this House.

We will look forward to looking at his signs, but we will also look forward to taking his strong support of the frozen food back to his people in St. Norbert. Shame on him.

Madam Speaker, the Minister of Justice (Mr. Toews) indicated in a letter, in fact stated in a letter, this was an initiative of the Winnipeg hospitals. Will the Minister of Health now have an honest explanation of the fact that this was a condition of the provincial government, the members opposite, this was a condition from the government down to the hospitals and, given that the taxpayers have paid for the Minister of Justice's letter, have the record cleared in an honest way for the people of this province?

Mr. Stefanson: Madam Speaker, I encourage the Leader of the Opposition to just do a little more research on this issue, and he will find that back in 1994 the Winnipeg hospitals decided to create a central food service to replace some increasingly outdated and expensive kitchens. They were concerned about the many problems of food costs, quality, and complaints by patients, so they chose to establish a central facility that had the potential to provide better food more economically. Those are certainly objectives that we support and we have continued to support through the last few years.

Mr. Tim Sale (Crescentwood): Madam Speaker, it is very clear from the letter that we have a copy of that was sent to Mr. Roy Brown, Deer Lodge Centre, that the conditions are set forth in point form, and they are very clear. They must, if they want to have their deficits paid, utilize the services of the Urban Shared Services Corporation for all appropriate system-wide initiatives, including food services, laundry services, logistics and group purchasing, including capital equipment. It is a condition, a coercive condition.

Will he not acknowledge that this was not a free choice on the part of the hospitals but was government policy imposed by a government that even hid the decision in 1994 from the people of Manitoba?

Hon. Eric Stefanson (Minister of Health): I have already outlined for his Leader the history of the establishment of the Urban Shared Services Corporation. It goes back to 1994. It was done with the support of the nine urban hospitals. Some seven hospitals here in Winnipeg are on that service to date. As we know, two have not come on that service yet because they have to do some capital improvements and have some other issues to address. Certainly the objectives of this whole initiative are very clear: to provide quality food, nutritional food, and to do it as efficiently and effectively as possible. I know those are difficult objectives for members opposite to support or understand, but we certainly support those objectives. Although this corporation has had a year where they have had some transition costs, Madam Speaker, those are still the objectives, and those objectives certainly can and will be met.

* (1355)

Mr. Sale: Madam Speaker, how does the minister then explain the letter from Concordia Hospital of February 26, 1998, which says your letter was discussed today at this month's regular board meeting and, to say the least, we were disappointed in the intimidating tone of your letter?

Madam Speaker, does he still maintain that these hospitals were not coerced into the frozen food disaster?

Mr. Stefanson: Again, I guess for the member opposite I have to be repetitive because that seems to be the only way he might understand the history of the establishment of this corporation. This is not something that just happened last year.

Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.

Madam Speaker: Order, please.

Mr. Stefanson: Well, Madam Speaker, as I was reminding the member opposite, this goes back to 1994, some five years ago, where hospitals decided to do this kind of a setup to centralize food services to avoid some $15 million in capital costs is the estimate, to save dollars through the centralization and co-ordination of delivery of food services, so those dollars will be available for the health care services in a whole range of other areas that are important to Manitobans, and to continue to focus on quality nutritional food. Certainly we have shared information with members opposite that shows the approval ratings in the facilities that are on this new system continue to get higher and higher and higher, and the approval ratings today are higher under the new food service system than they were under the old food service system. So the objective of quality nutritional food done as efficiently and effectively as possible to save resources is certainly one that we support.

Mr. Tim Sale (Crescentwood): Madam Speaker, if the minister is so certain of the quality of the food and the savings that are being achieved, will he not now then simply table the plan, the audited statements for the first period? What is he hiding and why is he afraid of letting Manitobans know what it costs, what has been saved, if anything–and, of course, nothing has been saved–and what the loss was in the first year in some detail? Why will he not table that information?

Hon. Eric Stefanson (Minister of Health): Madam Speaker, the Urban Shared Services Corporation themselves just put out information in the last week or so about their financial performance to date, and they did clearly acknowledge that in their first year of operation they did incur additional costs having to do with transition and some one-time costs. That year-end statement has just been completed. They are going, I believe, through their audit of that statement, but they did release the preliminary results which show that they incurred some additional costs. Their objectives, over their 20-year plan of this initiative, are to save capital costs, which they can and will do, to continue to improve efficiencies and provide this food on a more economical basis than would have been the case under the old system, thereby saving dollars that go directly into the health care system, and to continue to focus on quality nutritional food. Again, those are certainly very important objectives. They are objectives that we support, that I believe Manitobans support.

The member for Crescentwood, I would question his accuracy on most issues that he brings forward, recognizing just a couple of weeks ago when he brought information relative to Deer Lodge his accuracy was about 10 percent, and that is pretty pathetic.

Ms. Marianne Cerilli (Radisson): Madam Speaker, we have been raising this government's disregard for physical education and youth fitness for years. The Brandon School Division's reduction below the 180-minute requirement in the curriculum is part of a province-wide trend. I want to table for the government a copy of the chart prepared by the University of Winnipeg which shows, at the worst, Grades 1 and 2 students across the province are–70 percent of them–likely to be receiving less than the curriculum recommendation of physical education. I want to ask the Minister of Education with regard to his comments in the House the other day when he said: "Whatever it is that is mandated by the provincial authority is something that needs to be carried out. I would certainly want to take that up with the school division." I want to ask the minister if he has had time to look into the situation, and what is his assessment.

* (1400)

Hon. James McCrae (Minister of Education and Training): Madam Speaker, I have indeed been looking into the situation. It is a matter of some concern for–certainly in the Brandon School Division, a number of parents, students and teachers have been expressing concern, and they will be doing so, as I understand it, at this coming Monday's school division meeting.

I have not yet determined that I want to take the approach advocated by the New Democrats, which is to do away with school divisions and move in and take over all the decision making for school divisions. I have not gone as far as the New Democrats in that regard, Madam Speaker. I still respect the autonomy of school divisions. We have guidelines laid down from the Department of Education and Training. We monitor the situation with the school divisions but ultimately school divisions, these being guidelines, have decisions to make. In this case, I know the concern being raised by people in Brandon, and I know it will be thoroughly canvassed at the school board meeting on Monday night.

Ms. Cerilli: Madam Speaker, what we want to see is this government take some responsibility and accountability and realize and admit it is their example of showing that phys ed is expendable, with their cuts to phys ed, that is leading school divisions to believe that they can set requirements that are below the curriculum. Will you admit that and acknowledge that?

Mr. McCrae: Madam Speaker, I was reminded very effectively this morning with my colleague the honourable Minister of Environment (Mrs. McIntosh) as we visited with a number of daycare and kindergarten age schools, as we addressed the issue of safety with those children. The next generation of children will benefit from the program announced today by the Manitoba Public Insurance, the minister, and myself. It was truly a privilege to be in the presence of all those kids, but it reminded me of my responsibility and the responsibility of all of us when it comes to issues like physical education and, in Brandon's case, music.

The Department of Education and Training is indeed committed to the development of quality physical education and health education curricula, but I think what I am having trouble with is the position of the New Democrats that they have no regard whatsoever for elected school trustees throughout this province. On the issue of taxes, they want to change that, no role for school trustees. On this issue, no role for school trustees. We will make all the decisions right here on Broadway Avenue. That is not acceptable to me, Madam Speaker.

Ms. Cerilli: Madam Speaker, will the Minister of Education acknowledge that it is his department that sets curriculum, that there are 180 minutes required in his curriculum? Can he tell the House, with the more than $15 million of new money in their assessment division, what is going to be in place to ensure that the curriculum requirements in Manitoba's curriculum are met in school divisions?

Mr. McCrae: Again, Madam Speaker, I share the concern of the honourable member, as do the people of Brandon as they will be addressing that to their school division. The Brandon School Division is very aware of these guidelines that are laid down by the Department of Education and Training as well, so those matters will be canvassed on Monday night. The first proposal was the subject of a very close vote in the Brandon School Division, and the matter is going to be canvassed again this coming Monday. I expect that the right thing is going to happen. Whatever that is going to be at the end of it all, there has to be some kind of respect for elected people in this province. The New Democrats daily remind us of what their hidden agenda is, and that is to get rid of school boards. That is not the agenda on this side of the House. Every time something comes up–it happens with my colleague the Minister of Health (Mr. Stefanson) almost daily–they want the government of Manitoba to run every minute detail of health, education or any number of things right here from this building. I cannot think of a more arrogant, dictatorial approach than that.

Ms. Jean Friesen (Wolseley): Madam Speaker, there is a cartoon in the Brandon Sun this week which shows three students lining up for the race for the only history textbook in the school. But the real point that the cartoonist is making is that this is not just a race for the textbook, but this is going to be the only phys ed they are going to get in the Brandon schools. I would be happy to table that for the minister if he would like to see it.

Ms. Jean Friesen (Wolseley): I would like to ask the minister whether he is prepared to be accountable for the guidelines which his department sets or whether he is prepared to see schools across Manitoba cut by 50 percent, others by 75 percent and others by 25 percent. Is that the kind of education you want to see?

Hon. James McCrae (Minister of Education and Training): Accountability is the reason that we are all here in this Legislature, the reason that I sought office to be a member representing people so that we can serve, not lord it over them and not rule from above like honourable members opposite, but to serve people as humble servants of the people. The honourable members do not want accountability because they simply cannot handle the truth.

The truth is that education spending, when New Democrats had a chance, plummeted in Manitoba, and since their replacement in 1988 by the present administration, funding for education in Manitoba has climbed to 19.3 percent from the sorry 17.7 percent left by the previous administration. So, when it comes to accountability, I look forward to accountability. Honourable members opposite are not interested because they simply cannot handle the truth.

Ms. Friesen: Could the minister confirm that in fact the effect of his lack of accountability for his own guidelines is that what is happening across Manitoba is unequal education, where wealthier divisions can have music and physical education according to the guidelines and poorer divisions cannot? This is a complete reversal of education policy in the 20th Century.

Mr. McCrae: The honourable member knows very well that with the so-called equalized funding formula that was operated by the government she supported, one Jerry Storie and others, there had to be exceptions made in virtually every single division across this province. The honourable member for Crescentwood (Mr. Sale) knows all about this because he made up the numbers as he went along.

The formula was changed back in 1992 to bring about a fairer equalization system. Education funding in Manitoba is based on an equalized system which provides for a base level of funding for each and every pupil everywhere across this province. What is the honourable member talking about, because if it is about the commitment of government to education spending in general, I will compare the commitment of this government to the commitment of the previous government any day of the week?

Ms. Jean Friesen (Wolseley): My final supplementary is to the Minister responsible for the Children and Youth Secretariat. I would like to ask that minister to confirm that her government's policy of allowing such severe reductions in physical education in some parts of the province will undermine the health of children and will increase the health risk for those children already at risk.

Hon. Bonnie Mitchelson (Minister of Family Services): I thank my honourable friend for that question. There is no government that has made the commitment to children and to early intervention like the present government under our Premier's administration, Madam Speaker. I want to indicate to you that there was over $20 million in last year's budget and another $25 million in this year's budget for children and for early intervention programs that go a long way to ensuring–

* (1410)

Madam Speaker: Order, please.

Mr. Steve Ashton (Opposition House Leader): Madam Speaker, Beauchesne Citation 417 is very clear. "Answers to questions should be as brief as possible, deal with the matter raised and should not provoke debate."

I am beginning to wonder if the sound has been turned off on that side of the House because the question was about the reduction of physical education time in our schools, and the Minister of Education (Mr. McCrae) and now this minister are not even close. If they do not want to answer the question, they should sit down, instead of putting this kind of dribble on the record.

Madam Speaker: Order, please. On the point of order raised by the honourable member for Thompson–

An Honourable Member: Madam Speaker, on the same point of order.

Mrs. Mitchelson: Madam Speaker, it is unfortunate that members of the opposition, when they ask questions, do not want to hear the answers about what government is doing to support children and families. They rise on a point of order when in fact they do not like to get the information on what is happening and the good news in the province of Manitoba.

Madam Speaker: On the point of order raised by the honourable member for Thompson, I indeed will take the matter under advisement to carefully peruse the transcript from Hansard.

Madam Speaker: The honourable Minister of Family Services, to quickly complete her response.

Mrs. Mitchelson: There is no question that all of the early intervention programs like BabyFirst, like EarlyStart, like the Women and Infant Nutrition program that puts more money into the hands of families that are struggling to make ends meet, when they participate in programs that are going to get their children off to a healthier start to life, more ready to learn when they enter our school system with the greater ability to graduate from high school and take post-secondary education or enter jobs that are available–all of those things contribute to healthier children, healthier families, and we on this side of the House support that.

Mr. Kevin Lamoureux (Inkster): Madam Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Health.

We all recognize the importance of mobility for our seniors. In fact, many of those seniors who go into personal care homes rely on things such as electric scooters in order that they can have some sort of independence in being able to get around the facility.

Earlier in the session we had reference to the Rosewood Village as a private enterprise, and recently we got a call from someone in Winnipeg indicating–and the question to the Minister of Health is if he could comment on whether or not the government has a policy for the private home cares with respect to the electric scooters. In this particular case, Rosewood Village has indicated that they will not allow for mobility through electric scooters. Is the Minister of Health even aware of that?

Hon. Eric Stefanson (Minister of Health): Well, Madam Speaker, the member referred to the Rosewood initiative. It is one of four supportive housing projects that are underway in the province of Manitoba. Three of them are done by nonprofit organizations; one is done by the private sector. The Winnipeg Community and Long Term Care Authority is working with those four projects to provide home care services to people in those facilities. Again, I think that is something that we would all support in this House, recognizing that home care is an important service for those individuals. Certainly we have significantly expanded our Home Care program, now $147 million compared to about $45 million 11 years ago. The specific aspect relative to the utilization of scooters, if he is referring to the Rosewood facility, I am certainly prepared to look into that issue.

Mr. Kevin Lamoureux (Inkster): Madam Speaker, I would suggest to the Minister of Health, in looking at it, that the Minister of Health be aware that the Deer Lodge personal care facility does in fact allow for the electric scooters.

The question to the Minister of Health then would be: would he ensure that there is consistent policy, whether it is not-for-profit or for private, that this sort of mobility be consistent in all facilities?

Hon. Eric Stefanson (Minister of Health): Well, Madam Speaker, the member is comparing two different types of facilities. He referred to Deer Lodge which is a hospital and a personal care home facility versus Rosewood which is a supportive housing facility. The other similar supportive housing facilities are Rimmer House, Arlington House and the Fred Douglas Heritage House which will be coming on stream and is scheduled to open in September of 1999.

I have indicated I am certainly prepared to look into the specific issue relative to the utilization of motorized scooters for individuals in those facilities, but he is comparing different types of facilities, and certainly the need to provide home care to supportive housing is something that we support and again provides that much better health care services to all Manitobans.

Mr. Lamoureux: Madam Speaker, I look to the Minister of Health to acknowledge that both these have personal care facilities attached to them. I am asking the Minister of Health to ensure that there is consistency in policy in terms of mobility, that individuals should be able to use these electric scooters so that they can actually have the opportunity to get out and about within a facility. Consistency of policy is what we are looking for from the government.

Mr. Stefanson: Again, I think it is important that the member understand the difference between personal care home facilities and the supportive housing projects that are underway, and I have referred to the four that are underway. What they do is they combine apartment living with the various supportive elements in terms of home care and other support for the individuals in those facilities.

In terms of the concern he has raised about the utilization of scooters in those facilities, I have indicated I am prepared to look into that entire issue. But you are comparing different types of facilities when you compare a personal care home facility to a supportive housing facility.

Mr. Stan Struthers (Dauphin): This government's cuts to health care are forcing regional health authorities to propose scaling back rural ambulance service in many communities. Citizens of Manitou, Neepawa, McGregor, Grandview, Gilbert Plains, just to name a few, are worried that there are plans to eliminate or reduce their vital volunteer ambulance services. This government has established an Emergency Medical Services working group whose mandate it is to recommend to this government directions for rural emergency medical services.

My question to the Minister of Health is: will the minister assure rural Manitobans that their ambulance services are protected by telling the RHAs that any proposals to reduce or eliminate ambulance services will be frozen and subject to recommendations expected from this EMS working group?

Hon. Eric Stefanson (Minister of Health): Well, Madam Speaker, the member refers to the Emergency Medical Services working group which has representation from the regional health authorities. I believe there is municipal representation on that review committee as well. I actually asked this morning for, at a minimum, an interim report, if not the timing very shortly of the full report, because this is a very important issue right throughout Manitoba, particularly, obviously, rural Manitoba.

I have met with different RHAs, met with some communities discussing that issue. We are certainly looking at continuing to build what is an absolutely outstanding volunteer system in the province of Manitoba when it comes to providing ambulance services, so it is an important issue, and I have asked for, at a minimum, a status report and update so that we can continue to ensure that proper and adequate ambulance services are provided to each and every region of our province.

Mr. Struthers: Madam Speaker, the minister did not answer the question. What is the use of having a working group if the minister allows the RHAs to close down rural ambulance services before hearing the EMS group's recommendations?

Mr. Stefanson: Again, I have indicated to this member that we have asked for a report from that group immediately to see where they are at–whether we will be receiving their full report shortly or at a minimum an interim report–to ensure that those kinds of things do not happen. We want to ensure that ambulance services are provided to the communities that require them and that they are not terminated or cut off.

I know there have been one or two communities where there have been some concerns, and the RHAs are working diligently to ensure that those communities continue to get ambulance service. We are committed to do everything we can with the RHAs to ensure that communities continue to receive ambulance service.

* (1420)

Mr. Struthers: Well, in that case, why will this minister not simply move to freeze decisions that the RHAs could make eliminating ambulance services to small, rural communities? Why will he not provide that level of comfort to places like Manitou, Gilbert Plains, Neepawa, McGregor and Melita, and the list goes on and on? Why will he not do that?

Mr. Stefanson: Again, I think the member for Dauphin has sat beside the member for Crescentwood (Mr. Sale) far too long because he is adopting the same scare-tactic approach that happens from the member for Crescentwood. Obviously, the RHAs, the regional health authorities, which have citizens from communities throughout those regions, are just as concerned about ambulance service to those communities as the member for Dauphin is, just as we are just as concerned about ambulance service to all those communities.

They continue to work diligently to take all steps necessary to ensure that those communities continue to receive ambulance service while this group, which has representation from the regional authorities, from the municipalities and from other health care providers and the fire commissioners, does their work to provide us with a model that can continue to provide quality, excellent ambulance services right throughout Manitoba.

Mr. Eric Robinson (Rupertsland): I would like to just point out again that there has been tremendous stress on many people during the forest fires in the last few days. I brought to the Premier's (Mr. Filmon) attention yesterday circumstances faced by our people, including spoiled food in freezers and fridges. We have had reports from people who have gone back to Hollow Water, Manigotagan and Seymourville. Hollow Water, this morning a resident called us from there who just went back to their home and found that all their food was spoiled. So we are faced with another crisis situation, not only in those immediate communities but the secondary communities that were affected by the fire.

I know that the Premier (Mr. Filmon) gave me a positive response to my question yesterday. I would like to ask the Premier again today how fast we can get officials to deal with these people who are faced with this crisis currently.

Hon. Frank Pitura (Minister of Government Services): I thank my honourable friend for that question. It gives me an opportunity, too, to thank all those people who gave us a great deal of co-operation and understanding when they were asked to be evacuated. Also a thank you to the host communities who really opened up their homes and their hearts to everybody that came into their community, and I would like to thank them for that.

The response, specific to the member's question–I am advised by the MEMO department that there will be staff up there starting on Monday, and Monday is slated for St. Theresa Point and all of the communities along that area, including communities such as Poplar River, Poplarville, Berens River, First Nation Berens River, Paungassi, Little Grand Rapids, Bloodvein and Loon Straits will be visited by MEMO staff to take a look at the impact of the power outage and to assess damages.

Mr. Robinson: I appreciate the minister's response to my question, and I am sure that the people I represent will equally be happy with the response; however, I stress that we have a crisis situation in many communities. I wonder if the minister could dispense his staff much earlier than Monday because obviously people are going to be in dire need before the next two days expire.

Mr. Pitura: Madam Speaker, just in response to the member, I can certainly look into the possibility of getting those people up there much quicker. I am advised that there will be emergency social services people in the area tomorrow in Manigotagan and in Seymourville to meet with people there in regard to their evacuation expenses and money that they may have spent for food and clothing and shelter.

I would also like to advise the honourable member that, with the individuals who are still in an evacuation status as a result of their homes being destroyed by the fire, everything is being put into place to look after them in regard to temporary accommodations in terms of housing, furniture and home repairs, and that is going to be assessed in co-operation with Indian Affairs and Northern Development Canada.

Ms. MaryAnn Mihychuk (St. James): Madam Speaker, Manitobans are very concerned about the proper use of public funding and in particular when we hear of cases of public waste. We have seen this over and over again, Manitobans' commitment to dealing with these issues, by example, adopting recycling programs. Much of this stems from our ability to deal with tough times like the Great Depression and the Lyon-Filmon years from the past 11 years.

My question to the minister responsible for casinos: how can the minister explain the wastefulness by the McPhillips Street Station of the disposal of trees still dressed with the decorative lights, double-wire, heavy-duty outdoor lights still on the trees?

Hon. Darren Praznik (Minister charged with the administration of The Manitoba Lotteries Corporation Act): Madam Speaker, years of experience in this Chamber has, I think, taught us on this side that when members opposite come forward with allegations such as these, they should be thoroughly investigated because they do not normally turn out to be what members portray them to be. I will take the question as notice and investigate the matter.

Ms. Mihychuk: Madam Speaker, will the minister perhaps tell the House whether they have a government policy of kicking the lights out or throwing the lights out at McPhillips Street Station, and will he examine the disposal policy at the McPhillips Street Station and Club Regent?

Mr. Praznik: Madam Speaker, the member has attempted to be very humorous. Perhaps she would like me to arrange for an audition for one of the shows at the casinos.

As I have indicated, I will endeavour to find out what the situation is with respect to the Lotteries Corporation.

Ms. MaryAnn Mihychuk (St. James): Madam Speaker, once again I ask the Minister responsible for Lotteries what the cost of the renovations of the two casinos in Winnipeg are. What are the total costs of the additions and the renovations for the renewed casinos, McPhillips Street and Regent? What is the total cost?

Hon. Darren Praznik (Minister charged with the administration of The Manitoba Lotteries Corporation Act): Madam Speaker, if I remember correctly, those matters actually were discussed in the public realm. The Lotteries Corporation indicated the exact numbers when the matter was raised on a previous occasion, and they are in the public realm already.

Ms. Diane McGifford (Osborne): Madam Speaker, over the past several weeks, the Minister of Health (Mr. Stefanson) has promised money to just about everybody, palliative care advocates, midwives, birthing mothers, those who are suffering from MS, and the list pudding should go on. I guess we should have an election every year.

Madam Speaker: Order, please. Would the honourable member please pose her question.

Ms. McGifford: I noticed that one thing the minister has not offered money for is AIDS services, so I would like to ask the minister today, who knows that his government's record has been far from stellar, when he will be funding or making a funding commitment to the Manitoba AIDS services organizations.

* (1430)

Hon. Eric Stefanson (Minister of Health): Madam Speaker, we certainly contribute significant amounts of money in support of AIDS prevention and AIDS treatment and, again, the member may have seen recently an announcement of the coming together of four clinics here in the city of Winnipeg. The provincial government is contributing capital dollars to make sure that that happens. As well, we are providing additional operating dollars towards that initiative, again, to provide the appropriate service to individuals having to deal with AIDS.

Madam Speaker: Time for Oral Questions has expired.