Introduction of Guests

Madam Speaker: Prior to Oral Questions, I would like to draw the attention of all honourable members to the public gallery where we have this afternoon fifteen Grade 5 students from Archwood School under the direction of Mrs. Connie Stanley. This school is located in the constituency of St. Boniface.

On behalf of all honourable members, I welcome you this afternoon.

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Mr. Gary Doer (Leader of the Opposition): Madam Speaker, I would like to ask the Premier (Mr. Filmon): is there a policy on home care staff being asked to recruit people to be placed in private profit supportive housing in Manitoba?

Hon. Eric Stefanson (Minister of Health): Madam Speaker, I am just trying to understand the question from the Leader of the Opposition. A policy on home care workers for placements in private home care arrangements–I am assuming from his question he is suggesting that home care workers who basically work for the provincially funded home care system basically through organizations like the Winnipeg Community and Long Term Care Authority are providing those services. We all know that there are some private sector companies that provide some service enhancements to individuals who need home care services, but certainly there is significant support from the provincially funded Home Care program which in last year's budget was $123 million. In fact, some additional expenditures were provided in this budget year, '98-99. So actually the Home Care program is significantly greater than the $123 million. Certainly it is a very comprehensive program meeting the needs of individuals requiring home care in the province of Manitoba.

Mr. Doer: We have heard from a number of home care staff that there has been an attempt now to use the home care office–and we have a memo from the director of home care indicating that it expected that appropriate clients will be called to hear more information about the Rosewood centre. All clients on their caseload are to be called and identified, and pamphlets are to be sent now to "customers." Rosewood Village centre is owned by KPCC Management; its rents are between $1,375 and $1,975 per month. It is a private profit firm. Is it appropriate that provincially funded people are being asked to review files and recruit people and hand out pamphlets to "customers" for this private profit centre?

Mr. Stefanson: Well, again, we have an extremely comprehensive Home Care program in Manitoba. In fact last year nationally, it was recognized as the most comprehensive Home Care program in all of Canada. I have already indicated financially last year's budget, $123 million, in fact, a greater amount than $123 million being spent in 1998-99. We will wait for our upcoming budget in terms of the allocation for Home Care in the upcoming year. So, again, the program that is funded and run through the Winnipeg Community and Long Term Care Authority through the RHAs is funded significantly by the taxpayers of Manitoba, by the provincial government.

In terms of the some of the facilities the member is referring to, I believe home care services certainly are available from the publicly funded Home Care program. Individuals do have an opportunity to access private home care over and above or under different situations than the provincially funded program if they deem that that is required. But certainly the provincially funded program is extremely comprehensive. In fact, most would suggest it is the most comprehensive in all of Canada.

Mr. Doer: That is certainly what we argued when this minister was responsible for Treasury Board, and along with the former Minister of Health they tried to privatize the most comprehensive system in Canada. I am glad they have a pre-election conversion on the road to Damascus on this issue, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker, the minister indicated that home care is paid for by the taxpayers of Manitoba. Is it appropriate that the taxpayers of Manitoba pay for publicly funded home care staff to be located at the Rosewood centre for purposes of this recruitment drive to this private profit centre?

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Mr. Stefanson: Again, Madam Speaker, if individuals are assessed as being allowed to access the Home Care program in any given facility, we continue, and I am sure the Home Care program run by the WCA and the RHAs continue to look at the most efficient and effective way to provide that home care, and they will make the decision. If a given facility has a certain number of home care clients, so to speak, where it is more efficient to provide that through the individual being accessible right in that facility, that might very well be the most efficient way to provide that home care as opposed to having a number of home care workers coming into any given facility. So certainly, as much as we are proud of the fact that we have the most comprehensive program in all of Canada–we have tripled the home care budget in Manitoba since 1988–it certainly is incumbent on the organization and the program to always look at the most efficient and effective way to provide those very important services.

I know that is a concept that is awfully difficult for members opposite to understand, but it is incumbent on the people providing that service to always do it as efficiently and effectively as possible.

Mr. Dave Chomiak (Kildonan): Madam Speaker, my question is also for the Minister of Health. I have spoken with home care workers who never in the past were told that they had to go marketing for a private company to try to fill up spaces. Never before has a memo gone out from the director of home care to workers saying that they should phone their client list, put a record on their client list whether or not the person wants to go to the Rosewood and, quote, hand out pamphlets to potential customers where possible. That is, potential customers who are home care clients.

My question to the Minister of Health is: will you order today your home care co-ordinators and workers to stop marketing for the Rosewood home?

Hon. Eric Stefanson (Minister of Health): Madam Speaker, I certainly would be interested in the member tabling the document that he referred to.

I would think he would accept that if people go into the Rosewood facility and they are entitled to home care in Manitoba, Madam Speaker, they should receive home care in Manitoba. It is only members opposite who would support a system that would have a number of home care workers going into any one facility if you can do it more efficiently by having a single home care worker providing those services in any given facility.

So, again, I am certainly interested in the member tabling whatever information it is he has, but certainly if people in any given facility are entitled to home care in Manitoba, it is certainly incumbent on all of us to provide that home care.

Mr. Chomiak: Madam Speaker, would the minister not agree that with respect to personal care homes, an individual has a choice of going to three personal care homes? You are given that option and you are not pressured. But with respect to the new sort of quasi-marketing program under home care, home care workers are phoning clients and asking them, giving them pamphlets to a particular private facility and asking them. Will the minister not admit that that is wrong?

Mr. Stefanson: Again, I mean, if it is a matter of making individuals aware of what services are available to them if they meet the criteria, I would think that that is something that members opposite would support in terms of heightening awareness of individuals if they are in a facility that they also would be–

Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.

Madam Speaker: Order, please. I am experiencing difficulty hearing the honourable Minister of Health.

Mr. Stefanson: Madam Speaker, in terms of making sure that individuals are aware that they can access home care, obviously if they meet certain criteria–and the objective is also to provide that home care service in as efficient and effective way as possible throughout all of our facilities and throughout the entire program.

Mr. Chomiak: Madam Speaker, I will table the directive that has gone out from home care to its staff. I would like to ask the minister to explain why staff were asked to phone all the clients. They could not fill up the Rosewood. Now the criteria have been relaxed to try to fill up the Rosewood, and you have home care staff literally phoning their clients, marking on the assessment forms whether they want to go to the Rosewood or not, which is wrong, and giving the pamphlets to the, quote, customers to get them to go to the Rosewood, a private, for-profit facility that has been erected. Is this not wrong? Will the minister not stop it today?

Mr. Stefanson: Madam Speaker, I certainly repeat what I have already said to members opposite. We have the most comprehensive Home Care program in all of Canada.

Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.

Madam Speaker: Order, please.

Mr. Stefanson: Madam Speaker, as I have indicated, we have the most comprehensive Home Care Program in all of Canada. The budget for our Home Care program has been tripled in the last 10 years alone. It is now over $123 million. There is a set of criteria that individuals have to meet to qualify for home care, and certainly I would hope members opposite are not suggesting for a minute if people meet those criteria that they should not be provided with home care. Obviously they should be. It is also incumbent on the whole organization to continue to do that as efficiently and effectively as possible.

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Mr. Tim Sale (Crescentwood): Madam Speaker, will the minister not recognize that this facility is not even open yet and yet he has intake workers sitting in there encouraging people to come and be part of this private sector initiative? His home care director has suggested that every single person must be called and they must note why they say no, if they say no. I want to quote from the memo: I appreciate the work initially being done, but I feel it is essential that our program be recognized as being supportive and responsive to this initiative.

Madam Speaker: Order, please. Will the honourable member please pose his question.

Mr. Sale: Madam Speaker, this facility is located in the Premier's (Mr. Filmon) riding. Is the facility getting special treatment because it is located in his riding, special treatment in the form of staff on site and marketing from the--

Madam Speaker: Order, please.

Hon. Eric Stefanson (Minister of Health): Madam Speaker, there is no special treatment being given in any case here. Again, those kinds of accusations or suggestions coming from the member for Crescentwood are certainly par for the course, and we have grown to expect it, unfortunately, in this House.

We continue to provide a very comprehensive Home Care program in Manitoba. The organizations providing the services, the WCA, the RHAs, continue to look at the most efficient and effective way to do that. It is provided to the individuals in their homes, in their apartments. What we are seeing more and more of across Manitoba today are programs like supportive housing and enriched housing. Certainly a good number of the people in those facilities do qualify for home care, and again, I think it is incumbent to provide that home care as efficiently and effectively as can possibly be done, and we encourage organizations to do that.

Mr. Sale: Will the minister recognize that the facility is not even open yet? It is not a question of providing services to which people are entitled.

Will he answer whether or not the facility is getting special treatment because its owners have given a total of $30,000 to the Conservative Party, including $3,000 to the Premier's own re-election campaign in 1995?

Mr. Stefanson: Well, Madam Speaker, again the member for Crescentwood is up to the usual. At least his Leader has the common good sense to hand it off to the member for Crescentwood, because we are used to this kind of attitude and approach from that member.

Again I repeat, what we are seeing across Manitoba is we are seeing projects of a supportive housing and an enriched housing nature. Go into some of those facilities. Many of the individuals in those facilities are at a stage of life where they qualify for home care services. Again, the objective of many of these initiatives is to provide the services that people are entitled to, to provide the services that they need and to do it as efficiently and effectively as possible. That is certainly the appropriate way to handle home care in Manitoba.

Mr. Sale: Madam Speaker, will the minister and his government simply do the right thing and tell the director of home care that she is to tell her staff not to recruit people to live in this home, not to be present during the process of people visiting the place, and, yes, if people live there and they are entitled to home care after the fact, absolutely, but to stop marketing this home through publicly paid civil servants. Let it fail or succeed on its own merits.

Mr. Stefanson: Well, I am glad the member for Crescentwood finally acknowledges that if people are entitled to home care services they should be provided. It is certainly encouraging that they have recognized that obvious fact, Madam Speaker. Again, the whole objective of our Home Care program is to provide the services to the people when they need them, where they need them, and that is continually being done. We have more and more enriched housing projects, supportive housing projects, enriched and supportive housing projects right across Manitoba. Many of the individuals in those homes qualify for home care, and again, the organizations will continue to provide that in an efficient and effective manner.

Mr. Gerard Jennissen (Flin Flon): Madam Speaker, for more than 50 years Lynn Lake has contributed millions of dollars in provincial taxes. As well, residents have raised more than $350,000 for the Lynn Lake Hospital Foundation. This government wants that money and moved the hospital bank account, which became a factor in the closure of the Lynn Lake bank.

My question for the Minister of Health is simply this: why should the funds from the Lynn Lake Hospital Foundation not remain entirely for the purposes of the Lynn Lake Hospital, because that is the reason why the funds were raised in the first place?

Hon. Eric Stefanson (Minister of Health): Well, again, Madam Speaker, I will look into the specifics of the Lynn Lake Hospital.

But certainly with the RHAs in general, funds have been retained in two various accounts, one on the basis of foundations, capital accounts, and the other one on the basis of being able to retain some of the equity in RHAs. So certainly the pattern across Manitoba has been leaving a great deal of those funds in place throughout the regions to provide not only for health care services but in some cases to make contributions to the capital requirements in the health care facilities.

The specifics of Lynn Lake, I will certainly look into.

Mr. Gerard Jennissen (Flin Flon): Madam Speaker, could the minister explain why Lynn Lake will be required to raise a portion of any capital renovations to the Lynn Lake Hospital, in addition to using the hospital foundation money for such renovations?

Hon. Eric Stefanson (Minister of Health): Again, Madam Speaker, under certain projects–and I would have to look at the particulars of Lynn Lake–there is a community contribution policy in place in Manitoba. There has been a policy of one sort or another in place in Manitoba for many, many years. Other provinces like British Columbia have a 40 percent community contribution requirement; Saskatchewan has a 35 percent community contribution. Here in Manitoba, if a community makes its contribution up front, it is 10 percent; if they do it over 10 years, it is 20 percent interest free.

So again, depending on the nature of the capital project, not all capital projects require a community contribution. Depending on the nature, some of the projects do, and I am certainly prepared to look into the specifics of the Lynn Lake requirements.

Mr. Gerard Jennissen (Flin Flon): Exactly how long does this minister expect the people of Lynn Lake and surrounding area to wait before personnel shortages at the hospital are filled? The hospital now needs a manager, an X-ray technician, a lab technician and nurses.

Hon. Eric Stefanson (Minister of Health): Again, Madam Speaker, right across Manitoba we have made significant improvements in terms of accessing people in our health care system. Certainly when it comes to rural positions, there has been significant improvement in terms of more physicians in rural Manitoba and a number of specialty areas, whether it be anesthetists, oncologists and others. We have made continual improvement in terms of providing more. We certainly do acknowledge that we do need more nurses in Manitoba as does appear to be the case almost right across Canada. We are seeing other provinces under various programs to recruit more nurses.

Certainly for Manitoba there is a need to be recruiting more nurses. That is why we have taken a number of steps. We have established a $7-million fund in our province to deal with the issue of recruiting, retaining more nurses in our province. We are continually converting more positions in our health care system to permanent positions. That is what nurses tell us is required to provide the kind of stability that they require. So we are taking a number of steps to provide more nurses right throughout all of Manitoba.

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Mr. Kevin Lamoureux (Inkster): Madam Speaker, my question is again for the Minister of Health or as many are becoming to know, the minister of announcements. You know, last week the minister came out with so many announcements, it is called regurgitation–is the term–of announcements.

Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.

Madam Speaker: Order, please.

Mr. Lamoureux: As the Leader of the Liberal Party was out in Altona yesterday, representatives or individuals from Emerson were out there, and they were saying for the fourth time it was announced last week that the multimillion-dollar health care facility was going to happen in Emerson. Madam Speaker, people want to know are they going to be four times lucky–

Madam Speaker: Order, please.

Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.

Madam Speaker: Order, please. The honourable member for Inkster, please pose your question now.

Mr. Lamoureux: We are looking to the Minister of Health to acknowledge that it is one thing to make an announcement, it is another thing to actually materialize on an announcement. Four times announcing the same project is not necessarily a positive thing. My question to the Minister of Health is: does this government have any time frame when they are actually going to see some reality as opposed to an announcement and an announcement and a regurgitation of nothing but failed promises?

Hon. Eric Stefanson (Minister of Health): Well, Madam Speaker, I am somewhat bewildered by this question, because all the member needs to do is to drive around Winnipeg or drive outside of Winnipeg to many of our communities, and he will see examples of significant health care projects underway right across the province, whether he goes to Concordia Hospital or he goes to Misericordia Hospital or he goes out to Brandon or he goes to Morden-Winkler, or he goes into a community like Altona. The list goes on and on in terms of significant capital projects that are required here in the province of Manitoba.

I am certainly pleased that my colleague the MLA for Emerson (Mr. Penner) was a part of an announcement on Friday for building a new integrated health centre, including in-patient beds, emergency services, primary community health services and a 30-bed personal care home in Emerson, which is committed to and will be underway very shortly.

Madam Speaker: Order, please. The honourable member for Inkster, with a supplementary question.

Mr. Lamoureux: Madam Speaker, one would think the minister of announcements would be around the corner–maybe there is a possible election or something of that nature.

My question to the minister of announcements/health is: the capital policy, from what I understand, is that there should be 20 percent down or a commitment of up to 20 percent in order to get the capital project up and going. Has the community established that 20 percent, or can the minister enlighten us as to what degree they have come close to the 20 percent?

Mr. Stefanson: We have a community contribution policy which, if a community provides the money up front, it is 10 percent of the capital cost. The majority of projects that we have ongoing now, the communities have done it on that kind of a basis, and they are able to provide their support in one of many ways. In some cases they do direct fundraising; in some cases the municipalities make a contribution; in some cases there is some money left in their trust funds, their foundation funds, for capital projects.

Again, that has not been an impediment to capital projects going forward, in fact, quite the opposite. It has been a very positive part of our projects because it leads to more community involvement, it leads to significantly more review and due diligence on the projects. As a result of that, I believe we are ending up with the absolute most appropriate facilities in each and every case. As well, it includes the regional health authorities and their boards and their support staff.

I remind members opposite that the community contribution requirement in the province of British Columbia is 40 percent, in the province of Saskatchewan, 35 percent. So certainly ours is very reasonable stacked against those two provinces as examples.

Mr. Lamoureux: Can the Minister of Health tell this House, out of that $123-million capital project, how much of that has actually been approved through those communities that have actually raised the funds, and how much would just be election hype where they do not actually have the communities on side in terms of commitment to financial obligations?

Mr. Stefanson: Madam Speaker, again I just encourage the member to look around this province and see the significant capital improvements in our health care system. I obviously could go on beyond the list I have already mentioned, facilities like Riverview hospital here in the city of Winnipeg, and it goes on and on.

First of all, a number of these projects do not require a community contribution to begin with. Secondly, those that do, I am absolutely confident will all go ahead because to date that has not been an impediment in terms of any projects going ahead. Quite the opposite. It has led to significant community involvement and community contribution.

Going back to the member's first question, I would just encourage him the next time he talks to his Leader, talk to his Leader about the role that the federal government does, and remind his Leader that there is a time to stand up for Manitoba, like he should have been doing when he was a part of the federal Parliament, and he was there when $260 million each and every year was cut from funding support to the province of Manitoba, but yet we continue to commit hundreds of millions of dollars to needed health care projects right across our entire province.

Mr. Lamoureux: Yes, Madam Speaker, on a point of order, the Minister of Health knows full well that one should not necessarily be provoking debate. Having said that, given that he was a former Minister of Finance, he should understand that his figures are so far out of the ball park, it is absolutely amazing–$260 million. Obviously he is living on a totally different planet. In one year, $260 million?

Madam Speaker: Order, please. I am somewhat confused with the point of order raised by the honourable member for Inkster because I believe the point of order he raised was relative to the minister not provoking debate, but in his own comments, in my opinion, he also invoked debate. So I will therefore rule that there was no point of order.

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Mr. Leonard Evans (Brandon East): As we all know, the monthly labour force statistics showing the rate of unemployment in Manitoba excludes people living on reserves in this province and indeed across the country. But we do have information from the 1996 census for aboriginal groups both on and off reserves. If we assume the usual participation rate for Manitoba, we find the unemployment rate for reserves is around 50 percent, and at that I think it is understated, Madam Speaker.

If we look at a cross-section of reserves in this province, we see even higher rates such as 58.9 percent at Fort Alexander and 61.1 percent at Sandy Bay. So, Madam Speaker, in view of the serious economic and social consequences of this unacceptably high unemployment, is the Minister of Finance prepared to face up to this problem in the forthcoming budget and offer new programs that will help reduce unemployment and help these people out of poverty?

Hon. Harold Gilleshammer (Minister of Finance): I know the member knows that the manner in which these statistics are gathered and reported has remained the same as when they were in office. Certainly the unemployment rate was much higher at that time. We are very proud in Manitoba of all of the very positive economic indicators that reflect a very buoyant economy here. Our unemployment rate is at 5.4 percent, the lowest in the country. We have been creating full-time permanent jobs at about 10,000 permanent jobs a year, and all of the economic indicators point to real growth in the province of Manitoba.

I know the member for Brandon East has spoken out against the balanced budget legislation and would prefer to see deficits. I can recall him making speeches that deficits stimulate the economy. Certainly he is out of step with what is going on across this country. We believe in balanced budgets, and I believe, even if he does not, his Leader now believes in balanced budgets, although I know that members of his caucus still speak against it.

Mr. L. Evans: Madam Speaker, I am not sure what that answer had to do with my question.

I asked the minister–I want the minister–

Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.

Madam Speaker: Order, please. The honourable member for Brandon East, with a supplementary question.

Mr. L. Evans: I would ask this minister if he would face up to the problem of unemployment among both aboriginal and Metis people living off of the reserves where we find unemployment rates easily three to four times higher than the average for this province. The minister can talk all he wishes about low unemployment rates, but for this group of people it is absolutely intolerable.

So I am asking the minister: is he prepared to take some concrete steps? We are talking about a budget. We want initiatives. Is he prepared to take this matter seriously and provide, particularly for the unemployed aboriginal and Metis youth, the opportunities that they deserve?

Mr. Gilleshammer: Madam Speaker, certainly we are very pleased that the unemployment rate in Manitoba is the lowest in the country at 5.4 percent, but we are not finished yet. We believe that it will go lower, that there has been–as I have indicated to him–10,000 new, permanent full-time jobs created in the last year and 35,000 new full-time jobs created in the last four years.

The Maple Leaf plant in his backyard in Brandon–actually, it is probably in Minnedosa constituency. I believe that they are taking a very proactive stance. The mayor of Brandon has indicated that they will do everything in their power to create employment for unemployed people in the Brandon area, and that includes any of the citizens who live in that area.

Certainly in our discussions with the federal government, we will raise this issue and have them fulfill whatever commitments they can to create employment for aboriginal people.

Mr. L. Evans: Well, Madam Speaker, I ask the minister if he will acknowledge that Canada has transferred all responsibility for employment and training programs to the Province of Manitoba. Will he acknowledge that, and will he acknowledge that we need new employment initiatives in this budget–we are talking about a budget that is supposed to be coming down next week–to provide opportunities for our aboriginal people, opportunities that will enable them to get a job and raise their standard of living? If we look at figures, look at the income figures and see the wide disparity that has remained for the last decade under this government.

Mr. Gilleshammer: Madam Speaker, that is precisely why you are going to see tremendous growth in the community colleges across this province. The Minister of Education and Training (Mr. McCrae) announced funding for colleges today, and I can tell him that the Assiniboine Community College in Brandon and the other community colleges are going to certainly take in more students in the next few years to train them. We anticipate there will be at least a thousand more students brought into that system to get training and find jobs that do exist here in Manitoba.

Ms. Jean Friesen (Wolseley): Madam Speaker, the government's own documents on high-demand occupations in Manitoba indicate that in aboriginal communities, on and off reserve, in 1994 teacher aides, public health educators, social workers, addiction counsellors, et cetera, were all skills and occupations particularly required in aboriginal communities. In 1997, the same list occurs. In 1999, with one important exception, the same list occurs.

I would like to ask the Minister of Education why, in the 11 years of this government, on this government's watch they have been unable to meet any of the needs of these high-need communities.

Hon. James McCrae (Minister of Education and Training): The honourable member should be aware of something Nuala Beck said when she was taking part in the millennium conference. She said that while 37.3 percent of the Canadian workforce is employed in high-knowledge jobs, the number for Manitoba is 39.3 percent. I am a little disappointed because Ms. Beck also pointed out that we are second in the world to the Netherlands. I would appreciate it if we could work our way to being No. 1. That is why the announcement today which pays attention to the job market out there and the needs that are there in the job market, and in a very effective way, responds to it.

Ms. Friesen: Would the minister, who should be aware of the very clear differences and experiences between aboriginal communities and the rest of Manitoba, should be aware that his government's cuts–and will he confirm that those cuts to the Access programs have made it very, very difficult for aboriginal communities off reserve to meet the needs for training and for skills of those severely disadvantaged communities in Manitoba?

Mr. McCrae: The last thing I would do, Madam Speaker, would be to accept something coming as it does from the honourable member on this topic. Where was she when it came to offering praise to Anokiiwin school just the other day entering into a partnership with the Morris-MacDonald School Division to provide high school education for aboriginal people in Manitoba? Where is the praise that the honourable members opposite say will come when it is deserved? Well, it is certainly deserved and should be very much supported. I have not heard anything about that sort of private-public partnership that does so much for aboriginal people.

I have not heard any praise for the announcement today which provides for aboriginal opportunities in our community college sectors and the ongoing support through scholarships and bursaries for aboriginal and all Manitobans. I cannot understand the honourable member's question, and I certainly do not accept the preamble to it.

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Ms. Friesen: My final supplementary is to the Minister of Northern and Native Affairs. I would like to ask the minister to tell us why his government apparently believed in 1997 that medical directors and medical doctors were required in aboriginal communities and that in 1999 they do not seem to believe that. It is not on the list anymore. Is this an error or does the minister truly believe that medical doctors are not required in aboriginal communities?

Hon. David Newman (Minister responsible for Native Affairs): Madam Speaker, I have no knowledge of the allegation. I will take it under advisement and report back to the House.

Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Burrows, for one quick question.

Mr. Doug Martindale (Burrows): In the 1995 provincial election, the government promised to make health, education and social services child-centred, but since then cuts to health and education and children's services–

Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.

Madam Speaker: Order, please.

Mr. Martindale: This government cuts $23 million out of the welfare budget in 1996. The result is we have the highest rate of child poverty in Canada, the highest number of children in care and a thousand percent increase in children using food banks.

Madam Speaker: Question. Order, please.

Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.

Madam Speaker: Order, please. I would appreciate the co-operation of all honourable members in allowing the honourable member for Burrows to quickly pose the last question of Question Period. Indeed, time has expired, but he had been recognized before the clock had expired.

Mr. Martindale: Why does this government, after 11 years in office, have no strategy for reducing the rate of poverty in Manitoba, given that the Social Planning Council, the National Council on Welfare and the United Nations last December all have condemned this province for their treatment of poverty and doing nothing? They have no strategy. When will they get a strategy? After 11 years, they have nothing.

Madam Speaker: Order, please. The question has been put.

Hon. Bonnie Mitchelson (Minister of Family Services): I hear some of my colleagues indicate that I might be mad, but I am just extremely confused with the question that has been asked.

Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.

Madam Speaker: Order, please.

Mrs. Mitchelson: Well, Madam Speaker, I cannot understand how my honourable friend could say that 11,000 people who have moved off our welfare system and into the workforce is not a positive thing for the province of Manitoba.

Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.

Madam Speaker: Order, please. I am sure that everyone wants to have the minister complete her response. Could I please ask for the co-operation of all honourable members in allowing the honourable Minister of Family Services to complete her response.

Mrs. Mitchelson: Thank you very much, Madam Speaker. There is a definite difference between our government and the opposition, who still like to promote welfare as the option and the opportunity for the people of Manitoba.

Madam Speaker, we believe that people deserve the opportunity to work and to be productive in our community and our society. I make absolutely no excuses for working to try to ensure that people have jobs and have the ability to earn a higher income and move themselves out of poverty and into success and achievement. That is exactly the direction our government has taken with its economic policies that have allowed for the creation of jobs in Manitoba so Manitobans can work.

Madam Speaker: Time for Oral Questions has expired.