Madam Speaker: I have two rulings for the House.

On June 18 I ruled on a point of order respecting language used by the honourable First Minister in responding to the question and asked the Premier (Mr. Filmon) to withdraw the comments in question. A point of order was raised by the opposition House leader about the content of the withdrawal. I took the matter under advisement in order to examine the words spoken by the Premier and to consult the authorities.

Hansard shows that the Premier said, and I quote: "I recognize that, although things may be true, they can also be unparliamentary, and so I accept your admonition and I withdraw the comments."

I have carefully consulted the authorities and reviewed Hansard and past precedents. The opposition House leader did have a point of order. Parliamentary practice, borne out by Manitoba Speakers' rulings, is that withdrawal of words must be unqualified or unconditional and explanations are not required. I would therefore ask the honourable First Minister to make an unqualified withdrawal.

Hon. Gary Filmon (Premier): I am happy to make an unqualified withdrawal, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: I thank the honourable First Minister.

On April 6, 1999, the honourable member for Thompson (Mr. Ashton), the House leader of the official opposition, rose on a matter of privilege, claiming that the First Minister (Mr. Filmon) had deliberately misled the House. I thank all honourable members for their advice to the Chair on the matter.

The two tests for a matter of privilege are (1) was the matter raised at the earliest opportunity, and (2) is there sufficient evidence that the privileges of the House have been breached to warrant putting the matter to the House.

With respect to the first test, the honourable member did raise his matter at the earliest opportunity. With respect to whether the member has made a prima facie case, I would refer members first to Manitoba precedents as established by rulings of Speakers Walding and Phillips. These rulings clearly express that a deliberate misleading of the House requires an intent to mislead and/or knowledge that the statement would mislead. Also, Speakers Walding, Phillips and Rocan have ruled that when one member charges that another member has deliberately misled the House, the member making the charge must furnish proof of intent. In the parliamentary authority, Parliamentary Privilege in Canada, Joseph Maingot sustains this opinion. On page 224 he states that an admission that a member of the House was intentionally misled would be necessary to establish a prima facie case of a matter of privilege.

Therefore, short of a member acknowledging to the House that she or he deliberately and with intent set out to mislead, it is virtually impossible to prove that a member deliberately misled the House. Citation 494 of Beauchesne, quoted in rulings of past Manitoba Speakers, states that statements by members respecting themselves and particularly within their own knowledge must be accepted.

Although the honourable member for Thompson may have a grievance or a complaint against the First Minister, I must rule that he has not established a prima facie case of privilege and rule his motion out of order.

* (1420)

Mr. Steve Ashton (Thompson): I challenge your ruling.

Madam Speaker: Order, please. The ruling of the Chair has been challenged. All those in favour of sustaining the ruling of the Chair, please say yea.

Some Honourable Members: Yea.

Madam Speaker: All those opposed, please say nay.

Some Honourable Members: Nay.

Madam Speaker: In my opinion, the Yeas have it.

Mr. Steve Ashton (Opposition House Leader): Yeas and Nays, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: A recorded vote has been requested. Call in the members.

Madam Speaker: Order, please. The question before the House is shall the ruling of the chair be sustained.

Division

Ashton, Barrett, Cerilli, Dewar, Doer, Evans (Brandon East), Evans (Interlake), Friesen, Hickes, Jennissen, Kowalski, Lamoureux, Lathlin, Mackintosh, Maloway, Martindale, McGifford, Mihychuk, Reid, Robinson, Sale, Santos.

Mr. Clerk (William Remnant): Yeas 28, Nays 22.

Madam Speaker: The motion is accordingly carried.