Cancer Therapy
Pharmaceutical Coverage
Mr. Gary Doer (Leader of the Opposition): My question is to the First Minister (Mr. Filmon).
Unfortunately this week it has been a tale of two priorities with the government--unlimited amount of money for the hockey team, the Jets hockey team, in terms of infrastructure and losses that the taxpayers are covering, yet we hear that vital drugs are being cut off to children requiring them in cancer therapy.
I would like to ask the Premier--since yesterday we learned that another drug is being reduced and cut off for children that require cancer therapy, a drug called ondansetron, and that drug is an antinausea drug that is necessary for children that are receiving chemotherapy treatment--why has that drug been cut off, and can we find a way to fund these important priorities for children and families that are going through one of the most traumatic experiences, that facing their families with cancer?
Hon. James McCrae (Minister of Health): Madam Speaker, my information is that no child or no family of a child in these circumstances has been, as the honourable members says, cut off, and it is our undertaking that none will.
Mr. Doer: I thank the minister for the answer today. I wish we would have had that a week ago when the minister received correspondence. I think the families have gone through a traumatic experience with this uncertainty.
Madam Speaker, I would like to ask the minister, in light of all the cuts that are taking place and all the correspondence that is going on about the impact of these cuts, does the minister have in place a process to ensure that decisions are not made to cut off drugs as we have mentioned, as we mentioned yesterday and as we mention today, that decisions are made not to cut those drugs off for children requiring them for cancer therapy and other programs, that families will not go through this kind of trauma, that the Minister of Health has got a more hands-on approach to these issues and does not require the opposition to raise these issues in the Legislature?
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Mr. McCrae: Madam Speaker, I certainly agree with the initial comments made by the Leader of the Opposition.
As the Leader of the Opposition knows, the budgeting process allows for certain dollars to be budgeted for certain programs that are demand driven. In this particular case the demand equalled the budgeted amount early enough in the fiscal year to create a problem for the Manitoba Cancer Treatment and Research Foundation.
The honourable member's suggestion is also a good one in that we have a system in place to ensure that we do not unnecessarily raise concerns that do not need to be raised. So indeed I think we have the department, the Manitoba Cancer Treatment and Research Foundation, and the Health Sciences Centre working closely together to ensure that those sorts of things are addressed early enough so that they do not create concern.
Mr. Doer: I assume by the minister's answer, because the decision was made effective September 4 for the G-CSF drug, that there would be a different status before September 4 versus after September 4--and the drug that I mentioned in my first question, ondansetron, a drug that is required for children to be able to eat after they have chemotherapy programs, which the nurses have also been told has been cut because of government funding.
Will the minister table today in the House a process by which he will be able to determine whether the safety of patients and the health of patients in Manitoba will be protected in light of all the cuts that are taking place in health including the $19-million cut that is already trickling through the various programs and patients of the Health Sciences Centre and other related programs?
We do not want to continue to bring issues to the House. We want the minister to be in charge of the Health department, and we want to make sure that his promise in this House of protecting patients is truly a promise that he can keep, rather than having to come after these programs after they are cut off to get the government to reverse its decisions for safety of patients here in the province.
Mr. McCrae: Madam Speaker, I will just repeat for the honourable member that budgets for all kinds of programs are set based on the previous experience and the previous demand, and so these matters do arise.
In terms of the honourable Leader of the Opposition's comments about people facing very, very serious, sometimes even catastrophic circumstances, I can only point to my record of the past couple of years in dealing with issues that have come along like that. We have I think tried to deal as sensitively and compassionately as we can with families in this province.
Health Care System
Funding
Mr. Dave Chomiak (Kildonan): Madam Speaker, from his seat the Premier (Mr. Filmon) said it was not the government initiative that caused this cutback in program, but will the Premier or the minister not admit that it is government cutbacks to funding institutions that they have cut back the last two years that have strangled the budgets and not allowed them to do things like drug therapy, like hip and knee replacements, like surgery, and that is why we have the longest waiting list in the country, and that is why we have problems that we have to bring to the floor of this Legislature day after day after day.
Hon. James McCrae (Minister of Health): Madam Speaker, I reject everything the honourable member has said.
Pharmacare
Funding
Mr. Dave Chomiak (Kildonan): Maybe then the minister can explain why, in the Annual Report of the Department of Health released yesterday, it shows that payments to the Pharmacare program by the government have decreased by 20 percent the last two years. Can the minister explain that?
Hon. James McCrae (Minister of Health): Madam Speaker, if you look at our drug assistance programs I think you will find that they are either the best or among the best in this country.
Mr. Chomiak: Madam Speaker, as usual the minister did not answer the question.
I would like to ask the minister to explain why in the Annual Report of the Department of Health in 1992-93 it showed that expenditures for the Pharmacare program were $60.8 million, and why in the '94-95 Annual Report released yesterday it shows that expenditures in Pharmacare are down to $48 million, a 20 percent increase over two years. Can the minister try perhaps to answer a question and explain this?
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Mr. McCrae: Madam Speaker, the honourable member should not be quite so selective. He should look at the performance of the program over several years and he will see significant increases in commitment by the government at a time when we have been dealing in extremely difficult economic times and circumstances, at a time when our colleagues, our friends, whatever they are in Ottawa have made life pretty difficult for all of the provinces because of the handling of the finances of the Government of Canada.
Indeed, Madam Speaker, we are not working in any easier times today, as the budget by Mr. Martin on February 27 would indicate, and we face significant challenges. At a time when you do face significate challenges like that, it is nice to be a Manitoban because we are working with budgetary circumstances which have been worked on carefully for seven and a half years. We are able to withstand the kinds of pressures that we are going to have to withstand, and we are in a much better position than most other provinces in this country.
Health Sciences Centre
Outpatient Chemotherapy Program
Mr. Tim Sale (Crescentwood): Madam Speaker, there is mounting evidence from the $8-million underspending in the first quarter statement in the Health department that the government's health cuts are hurting deeply, especially for those most at risk, cancer patients and their families.
Can the minister confirm that the $19-million cuts now underway at Health Sciences Centre are putting at risk the outpatient chemotherapy program at Health Sciences Centre? Will he confirm that?
Hon. James McCrae (Minister of Health): Madam Speaker, in anticipation of preparing budgets throughout Manitoba, all of the hospitals, all of the facilities and all the caregivers are in the process of reviewing how best they are going to provide the highest quality service they can to Manitobans, at a time when budgetary pressures are pretty significant. So we have discussed this before.
Health Sciences Centre is one of many hospitals looking at options that might be available to them. I am not here to confirm anything the Health Sciences Centre might be looking at by way of options for dealing with next year's budget.
Mr. Sale: Madam Speaker, could the minister then explain why in the parents' newsletter, Parents of Children with Cancer, why they say the following: The programs are under review and may be transferred to other departments, which are under the gun to cut their budgets. It is coming out of the pharmacy pocket now. Plans are to shift it to the Children's Clinic pocket. They, of course, do not feel they can sustain such a program with their limited financial resources. Therefore, it will come under review.
Can the minister explain why the parents feel that this program is very much at risk under the $19-million cuts?
Mr. McCrae: Madam Speaker, if I was in the position of the parents referred to by the honourable member, I think I would share the same kinds of concerns, but I say to those parents and I say to the honourable member that I am not aware of any child that has been impacted in the way that was raised yesterday by the Leader of the Opposition (Mr. Doer). As I have said, we are going to ensure that does not happen.
Mr. Sale: Madam Speaker, can the minister tell Manitobans with cancer and children with cancer how it is possible to cut every budget simultaneously without deeply hurting our ability to offer hope to those with life-threatening illnesses?
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Mr. McCrae: Madam Speaker, the assurances I am giving today, the assurances given by Dr. Brent Schacter of the Manitoba Cancer Treatment and Research Foundation, the assurances indeed given by the manufacturers of these drugs I think go some distance toward providing the kind of assurance that the honourable member is talking about.
I am not here to pretend that Ottawa is not taking $7 billion out of the health and social transfer across this country which will have a very, very significant impact here in Manitoba and elsewhere, but I say by virtue of our performance in the last seven and a half years, we have laid a much stronger foundation than Health ministers and social services ministers in other provinces are having to face.
AIDS Prevention
Government Strategy
Ms. Diane McGifford (Osborne): Madam Speaker, my questions are also for the Minister of Health.
Over a year ago, the Krever inquiry into Canada's blood supply met in Winnipeg and exposed this government's dismal record regarding services to persons living with HIV-AIDS. Sunday, October 1 is the date of the annual AIDS walk and nearly one year ago this government's Department of Health, after seven years of silence, initiated the development of an AIDS strategy. The weeks go by, people die, nothing is announced and Manitoba remains one of two provinces in Canada without an AIDS strategy.
My first question to the minister is this: Given that the Manitoba data indicates that if the annual increase in infected individuals continues at the current pace the number of Manitobans infected with AIDS will double in five years, how can the minister justify cuts to services in Manitoba?
Hon. James McCrae (Minister of Health): Madam Speaker, working with the advisory committee on AIDS, the development of a new AIDS strategy is underway.
The honourable member's question is very general in nature, and I think some of the answers I have given previously respecting our ability in Manitoba to deal with the pressures that are being thrust upon us by our federal counterparts--nobody is saying that it is easy for any government in this country, but I am proud of the fact that during the course of all of this we have consulted something in excess of 15,000 Manitobans in the development of our responses to the challenges that we face.
Ms. McGifford: Can the minister tell us how many staff years in Manitoba Health are devoted to the care, treatment, education and prevention of HIV-AIDS?
Mr. McCrae: Madam Speaker, I will ask the department to prepare an inventory of the kinds of services available and the numbers of people involved in them. The kind of question the honourable member is asking is more appropriately asked during the Estimates process of the Department of Health. We spent something, I think, in excess of 50 hours on this particular matter--the Health Estimates. We will consider this an Estimates question and get a written response for the honourable member.
Ms. McGifford: Madam Speaker, I understand the staff year is .5.
Madam Speaker: Order, please. The honourable member for Osborne, to pose her question now.
Ms. McGifford: Can the minister tell the House if the government still intends to release an AIDS strategy, and when?
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Mr. McCrae: Madam Speaker, an AIDS strategy will be announced when all of our consultations are complete. I do not accept the honourable member's assertion that half a staff year is devoted to the issues related to HIV-AIDS.
Rural Crisis Line
Government Commitment
Mr. Kevin Lamoureux (Inkster): Madam Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Health.
In Winnipeg, we have fortunately a line which we call the Klinic crisis line and which is open 24 hours. If individuals have some stress, they can feel free to call that line at no cost. In rural Manitoba, of course, we have the rural stress line. There is a great deal of concern in terms of the funding of this particular line and the resources that they require.
I would ask the Minister of Health, is the government equally committed to the rural stress line as it is to the urban stress line known as the Klinic crisis line in the city of Winnipeg?
Hon. James McCrae (Minister of Health): Madam Speaker, I wish the honourable member had kept himself up to date on all of the developments in the reform of mental health services in Manitoba over the past two or three years. Many, many services have been instituted in rural and northern Manitoba that never existed prior to the election of this government in 1988. Through mental health reform, people in communities are now able to access the services of community mental health workers, crisis stabilization centres, drop-in centres, self-help organization drop-in centres, assisted housing, assisted employment programs. I invite the honourable member to write to me and ask for the catalogue of services that have become available in mental health.
The honourable member asks a specific question about the crisis line which is still a matter that is under review. There have been significant concerns raised about the rural crisis line by other caregivers. Madam Speaker, we are duty bound to listen to those concerns too.
Mr. Lamoureux: Madam Speaker, I am asking the Minister of Health if he is going to acknowledge the need of the rural stress line and ensure that the government's commitment is going to be there to ensure that this particular program is going to be there into the future. It has only been in place for a year. It does need proper resources in order to make sure that it is feasible. In Winnipeg, we have the Klinic which is virtually fully funded by this government.
Is this government prepared to make the same sort of a commitment to the rural stress line?
Mr. McCrae: I just want the honourable member to know that I have been dealing quite frequently with the Canadian Mental Health Association and the farm groups who are proponents of the crisis line. We have raised with them the concerns raised with us by the women's shelter organization respecting the operation of the crisis line. We have also raised with them the idea that there ought to be some sort of inventory of all the different lines that are available to Manitobans and an appropriate co-ordination of all of that.
So the work continues, Madam Speaker.
Mr. Lamoureux: Madam Speaker, it is a question of fairness. I ask the Minister of Health, will he treat the rural crisis line in the same fashion that we are treating the city of Winnipeg Klinic crisis line?
Mr. McCrae: Well, it is a little bit surprising to have a Liberal lecture me about fairness when it comes to rural Manitoba, Madam Speaker. I did not hear the honourable member--
Madam Speaker: Order, please.
Point of Order
Mr. Gary Kowalski (The Maples): On a point of order, I understand the rules for answering a question is it should not incite debate. The first comment of the minister was nothing more than an attempt to incite debate and did not, in any way, try to answer the question, and I think it should be ruled out of order.
Madam Speaker: Order, please. On the point of order, the honourable member for Maples indeed does have a point of order. I would remind the honourable Minister of Health that his responses to questions should deal with the subject matter raised.
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Mr. McCrae: I apologize, Madam Speaker. I did not mean to get the honourable member going like that.
With respect to fairness for rural and northern Manitoba, I simply remind honourable members of some of the kind of support that this government has provided to the agricultural community. I think of programs like Decentralization and wonder why we could not have had more support from some of my colleagues in this House.
If that is an inappropriate thing to say, Madam Speaker, well, I am sorry for that too. But it is a fact, and we do need support for all manner of issues related to fairness amongst Manitobans. We had a debate yesterday about that very matter.
Many of my colleagues are here to remind me about fairness for rural and northern Manitoba. Madam Speaker, that will be on our minds as we address the issues related to the rural crisis line.
Education System
Physical Education
Ms. Jean Friesen (Wolseley): Madam Speaker, I wanted, before I ask my question, to clarify for the Minister of Education (Mrs. McIntosh) that the question I asked yesterday about the decline in incoming--
Madam Speaker: Order, please. I would ask the honourable member for Wolseley to pose her question with the appropriate preamble. My understanding is that the member is questioning something and that would only arise if a point of order had been raised.
The honourable member for Wolseley, to pose her question now.
Point of Order
Ms. Friesen: Madam Speaker, on a point of order. My purpose was to correct a number that I used yesterday.
Madam Speaker: I will accept the point of order. The honourable member for Wolseley, on a point of order.
Ms. Friesen: So it is a point of order to correct a number.
Madam Speaker: That is accurate.
Ms. Friesen: Thank you, Madam Speaker. I wanted to correct for the Minister of Education that the question I asked yesterday about the decline in incoming international students at the University of Manitoba since the introduction of differential fees should have used a number of 58 to 60 percent decline, a number which I am sure she is as concerned about as we are.
Madam Speaker: I thank the honourable member for Wolseley on that point of order for clarification.
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Madam Speaker: The honourable member for Wolseley, now to pose her question.
Ms. Friesen: My question is for the Minister of Health (Mr. McCrae), and I want to table three copies of a report in the Journal of the National Cancer Institute indicating recent research linking regular exercise in the reduction of breast cancer risk in young women. Madam Speaker, this is an important study because it has been difficult to delineate the relationship between exercise and particular types of cancer.
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The study concludes by saying, and I quote: Our results strongly support the need for education policies that require participation in physical education classes and that encourage lifelong participation in exercise programs.
I want to ask the Minister of Health why his government refuses to require the teaching of physical education throughout the high school years in Manitoba.
Hon. Linda McIntosh (Minister of Education and Training): The requirements for physical education, as the member knows, extend through to the end of the second year of high school as they did when the NDP were in government.
Ms. Friesen: Could I ask the Minister of Health to respond to new research, and will the minister give us a timetable for the implementation of his own report, the healthy child report, which says that every school in Manitoba should mandate physical activity, quality daily physical education, from K to Grade 12 as an essential component of a child's school day?
Hon. James McCrae (Minister of Health): The Department of Education and Training joins with the Department of Health, the Department of Family Services and the Department of Justice in the work of the Child and Youth Secretariat, headed by Mr. Reg Toews. The kind of report and recommendations to which the honourable member refers this morning is the kind of report that would be placed in the hands of those four departments at that secretariat and taken from that point.
Nonetheless, we are pleased with some of the things that we have been able to do in the area of breast cancer detection and prevention through the diagnostic programs set up in Manitoba and other initiatives as well. The report the honourable member talks about will no doubt be reviewed by the secretariat.
Gambling
Social Costs-Youth
Mr. Steve Ashton (Thompson): Yesterday, we learned that $118,000 was spent on two studies into lotteries which were attempted to deflect concerns raised by Dr. Cyrenne, a report in the Free Press.
Today, we are learning once again just how serious some of the potential problems from the dramatic increase in gambling that has taken place in Manitoba can be. There is a Nova Scotian expert who stated that electronic gambling is a colossal catastrophic calamity for the next generation, further went on to suggest that there is compelling evidence that in fact youngsters are gambling in unprecedented numbers.
I would like to ask the Minister responsible for Lotteries why there is virtually no reference, in fact there is only one brief reference to problems with gambling amongst young people in the $118,000 worth of reports that were commissioned by the Lotteries commission.
Hon. Eric Stefanson (Minister charged with the administration of The Manitoba Lotteries Corporation Act): I will remind the member for Thompson that we are the only province in Canada to do not one but two studies on the whole issue of problem gaming and problems arising as a result of gaming activities. We did one in 1993 by Dr. Rachel Volberg and we did a follow-up study in 1995, which I have provided him a copy of and I encourage him to read that document.
Mr. Ashton: Madam Speaker, will the Minister of Lotteries perhaps read the recommendation from the Health of Manitoba's Children report issued this year, March 1995, which pointed to some of the impacts of gambling, the increase in gambling that has been expressed particularly in rural Manitoba which started the process of VLTs and specifically recommends that research be conducted into the impact of gambling on children in rural and northern areas?
Mr. Stefanson: I have outlined to the member for Thompson that we have probably led the nation in terms of the quality and the kind of research that is being done. We have done not one but two studies on problem gaming, unlike any other jurisdiction in Canada. We have also done a significant economic analysis that I provided the member with yesterday, Madam Speaker.
So again, in terms of the kind of research, the quality of research, I do not think Manitoba takes a back seat to any province or any jurisdiction, and we continue to pursue quality information to allow Manitoba Lotteries Corporation and our government to make future policy decisions.
Mr. Ashton: Madam Speaker, a final supplementary: Will the minister admit that the one thing, the only thing that Manitoba has led the way in is a tripling of gambling revenue particularly from VLTs with almost no consideration of the social effects? Will he now constitute the real studies that we need, not the $118,000 to attack the Free Press and Dr. Cyrenne, but reports on the major impact gambling is having on adolescents and young people?
Mr. Stefanson: Madam Speaker, I will not admit any such thing, and, again, the member for Thompson refuses to listen to answers.
I have informed him about the reports prepared by Dr. Rachel Volberg, the only jurisdiction to have two reports. In that report, when she talks about the problem of pathological gambling she shows in 1993 the level was 4.2 percent, and even with the introduction and expansion of VLTs in entertainment centres the level is 4.3 percent two years later, basically flat during that period of time. So again Manitoba is leading the nation in terms of the quality of information.
The problem with the member for Thompson is he does not read all the information and he only comes back with answers that he wants.
Point of Order
Mr. Ashton: On a point of order, Madam Speaker, Beauchesne is quite clear in terms of Beauchesne's Citation 417 referring that answers should refer to the question raised.
You know, the minister continues to get into these personal comments in terms of listening or not listening. I am not going to comment on his answers in the personal sense. I would appreciate it if he did not do the same. He is out of order, Madam Speaker, and I would ask if you ask him to give answers to the very serious questions about youth and gambling, not engage in the kind of irrelevant debate he is doing currently.
Madam Speaker: Order, please. On the point of order, I would remind all members to pick and choose their words carefully. All members in this House are referred to as honourable members.
Winter Roads
Norwin Contract
Mr. Eric Robinson (Rupertsland): My questions are for the Minister of Highways and Transportation.
Over the past two years the department has cut the budget for winter roads in northern communities while spending thousands of dollars on consultant's reports.
This question that I have for the minister is whether or not he has accepted the proposal of Norwin for a long-term contract which will hire local residents and create employment in these remote communities.
Hon. Glen Findlay (Minister of Highways and Transportation): Madam Speaker, Norwin had a five-year contract with the department. It expired last year. The department is currently in the process of negotiating a potential agreement with Norwin at a price that is deemed to be appropriate.
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Mr. Robinson: A letter was forwarded to Norwin by the minister and it says roughly that in the event that there is no agreement by the end of this month, it would be open to public tender.
I would like to ask the minister, if indeed the Norwin contract is not accepted by this province, does this mean that First Nations people will be shut out and the possibility for local employment not there for the people of these communities?
Mr. Findlay: No, Madam Speaker. If the process leads to opening it for bids, Norwin or any other First Nations company or group that wants to bid can bid.
Highway Construction Projects
Capital Spending
Mr. Gerard Jennissen (Flin Flon): Madam Speaker, my questions are for the Minister of Highways and Transportation.
This past March the minister released a budget showing an expenditure of $103 million on capital spending. What are the current estimates of how much of that committed spending will in fact be done in the current fiscal year?
Hon. Glen Findlay (Minister of Highways and Transportation): Madam Speaker, over the course of the last two years we have certainly got more of our tendering out earlier because that is what was needed to give the industry advance warning as to what the projects were. This summer has been an excellent summer for construction because it has been dry, and I would expect because of that, because of those two events, the whole budget will be expended.
Certainly, it is very difficult to be absolutely sure at this time because projects are in the cleanup phases, but we fully expect the budget to be expended.
Mr. Jennissen: Will the minister today guarantee that the projects identified in the Estimates as part of the capital spending for 1995-96 will in fact proceed, weather and equipment permitting?
Mr. Findlay: Madam Speaker, the member should be aware that at any given time we might have about two times the budget out in front of the industry in various stages, but the amount that could be expended in any one year is only the total of the printed budget.
Department of Highways and Transportation
Layoffs
Mr. Gerard Jennissen (Flin Flon): Will the minister tell the House whether any of the over 125 Highways department staff being laid off are being cut to save money which is being diverted to pay for the forest fires or flooding?
Mr. Glen Findlay (Minister of Highways and Transportation): Madam Speaker, notice has been given that there will be some layoffs and it is again due to the same reason as I mentioned before. The projects proceeded rapidly and early in the year. Now the department management finds that there is not enough work to keep them fully employed through the period of January, February, March. It is very difficult to keep people employed if the work has all been completed and that is the circumstance that exists.
The number that will be affected is still unknown and the length of time that the layoffs may be in place is still unknown, but I understand that no matter who is laid off, the recall will be April 1.
Immigrant Referral Centre
Government Evaluation
Ms. MaryAnn Mihychuk (St. James): Madam Speaker, my question is to the Minister of Culture, Heritage and Citizenship.
Last week the minister indicated to the House that he had allocated resources to evaluate the new immigrant assessment centre. He also stated that he felt it was a more efficient way and immigrants would be better served if the province took the lead in providing these services.
Will his department's evaluation be directed towards delivering this service, as an example of the province taking responsibility in this area, and call a meeting of those partners and the service providers?
Hon. Harold Gilleshammer (Minister of Culture, Heritage and Citizenship): I appreciate the former trustee from Winnipeg No. 1 School Division is still advocating for her former division.
That centre that the member speaks about is under consideration. We have dedicated some staff time and resources to working with a number of the groups within the settlement community, and I would hope that some of the issues around that will be resolved in the near future.
Ms. Mihychuk: Will the Minister of Culture, Heritage and Citizenship, who is a former principal, indicate to the House, will the evaluation also include co-ordinating with the Department of Education who has cut--indicated to immigrants that she is not willing to fund the ESL portion of this project?
Mr. Gilleshammer: Madam Speaker, as I indicated to the honourable member a week or so ago our funding for ESL programming in Manitoba has remained stable. The problem with some of the funding lies with the federal government. They are on a course to withdraw that funding.
I have indicated to her before that the province does not have the ability to backfill for these federal cuts.
Ms. Mihychuk: I have a final supplementary to the minister.
Will the minister ensure that the bungling displayed by the Department of Education, in terms of the student loans process, will not occur in the provision of services for new immigrant families in a project that has been proven to be effective and exists in York and in B.C.?
Mr. Gilleshammer Madam Speaker, the honourable member, who sits with so many bunglers in that particular caucus, I am sure is having difficulty sorting some of these issues out.
I would point out to the honourable member that our resources that have been dedicated towards ESL in settlement issues have remained stable.
VLT Revenues
Dauphin Statistics
Mr. Stan Struthers (Dauphin): Yesterday, the Minister of Finance confirmed that cabinet knew the community-by-community breakdown of VLT revenues in November of 1994 and refused to release Dauphin's figures.
Since Dauphin does have more than four sites, why did the minister withhold from the people of Dauphin these VLT figures until after the provincial election?
Hon. Eric Stefanson (Minister charged with the administration of The Manitoba Lotteries Corporation Act): Madam Speaker, I answered a very similar question yesterday in committee put forward by the member for Thompson (Mr. Ashton).
To put the record straight, the information was available at the end of November on a site-by-site basis, but based on discussions with the Ombudsman it was determined that there was a need for third-party confidentiality and that therefore only communities that had four or more sites should have the information provided on a community-by-community basis. That was done on a province-wide basis.
At the same time it was determined that in terms of providing all of the information it should also show funds going back into communities. Ultimately that report was produced, submitted and released immediately in June of this year.
Deficit Reduction
Mr. Stan Struthers (Dauphin): Why is it that communities such as Dauphin, Flin Flon and Thompson make such a high per capita contribution toward the provincial debt while areas such as Pembina and Springfield who have cabinet ministers pay so little?
Hon. Eric Stefanson (Minister charged with the administration of The Manitoba Lotteries Corporation Act): Madam Speaker, what a totally ridiculous question. The member knows if he looks at the analysis that communities have an opportunity to apply for programs whether it is the REDI program or Community Places and so on. Based on that, there is an amount available to be distributed on a proportionate basis.
The good news, Madam Speaker, is I think the people of Dauphin and Flin Flon take the deficit seriously. They want to see the deficit eliminated here in Manitoba, unlike members of the NDP, and that is why they are on that side of the House.
Gambling
Addiction Treatment Programs
Mr. Stan Struthers (Dauphin): Madam Speaker, will the minister admit that the $118,000 he spent commissioning reports to criticize the independent report of Phillipe Cyrenne would have been much better spent counselling the thousands of people addicted to this government's slot machines?
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Hon. Eric Stefanson (Minister charged with the administration of The Manitoba Lotteries Corporation Act): Madam Speaker, I will admit no such thing and I wish the member would get his information correct, that that was a report commissioned--and it was indicated to the member for Thompson (Mr. Ashton) yesterday--by the Manitoba Lotteries Corporation.
In terms of meeting the needs of people with problems or educating the public, we provided the Manitoba Addictions Foundation originally with $2.5 million over five years. They came back and asked for another $416,000 and that funding support was provided, Madam Speaker, because we take that issue very seriously and will attach the resources that are required to educate, to counsel and to deal with any potential problems with gaming.
Poverty Rate
Calculation
Ms. Marianne Cerilli (Radisson): Earlier this week the Minister of Family Services made comments to suggest that people living below the poverty line really are not poor in Manitoba.
I would like to ask the minister to confirm, given that the low-income poverty line is calculated by figuring the total amount of money that people are spending for basic necessities including food, shelter and clothing, more than 56 percent of their income, if that is not the level that this minister is using to determine low-income Manitobans, what level is she proposing?
Madam Speaker: The honourable Minister of Family Services, with a very short response.
Hon. Bonnie Mitchelson (Minister of Family Services): I thank my honourable friend for the question, because it does provide me with the opportunity to clarify exactly what I did say the other day.
Madam Speaker, there are people who live below the poverty line who would be terribly offended if they knew that their children were included in the statistic that says there are so many children living in poverty.
Madam Speaker, there are people who live below the poverty line whose children are well nourished and loved and nurtured. Those children are not living in poverty, although their family income may be low. The children that we need to focus our energies and our efforts on are those children that are living below the poverty line that are neglected and abused and malnourished.
Madam Speaker: Time for Oral Questions has expired.
NONPOLITICAL STATEMENTS
Annual Walk for AIDS
Ms. Diane McGifford (Osborne): I request leave to make a nonpolitical statement.
Madam Speaker: Does the honourable member for Osborne have leave to make a nonpolitical statement? [agreed]
Ms. McGifford: Madam Speaker, on Sunday, October 1, the annual Walk for AIDS will take place in Winnipeg and in other Canadian cities. The purpose of the walk is to translate hope into action, remember those who have died and raise funds for HIV-AIDS prevention, education, care and treatment.
Last year 300 people and several corporate sponsors raised $30,000. The goal of the committee this year is to raise $50,000.
Let those of us who are in the House today remember, as John Donne has told us, no man is an island, entire unto himself. When someone dies from AIDS, the bell tolls for all of us.
Committee Changes
Mr. Edward Helwer (Gimli): Madam Speaker, I move, seconded by the member for La Verendrye (Mr. Sveinson), that the composition of the Standing Committee on Public Utilities and Natural Resources be amended as follows: the member for Minnedosa (Mr. Gilleshammer) for the member for Springfield (Mr. Findlay); the member for River Heights (Mr. Radcliffe) for the member for St. Vital (Mrs. Render); the member for Turtle Mountain (Mr. Tweed) for the member for Gladstone (Mr. Rocan).
Motion agreed to.